Reg
location: back to the wilderness
listening to: static
registered: 1999.11.22
posts: 6470
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Yes, my thinking was Hillary would win because basically most signs
pointed to that and Trump was a very very self destructive candidate. I
thought it would be close though and that Hillary would win by a slim
margin. It seemed a lot of people felt she would have a giant victory and
that's what most in the media predicted but there was all along one giant
indicator that she would struggle.
The country during the primaries voted in a very big way against
establishment candidates. Trump destroyed the establishment Republicans
in the primary. The Republican party had a gigantic WTF moment watching
this happen and obviously had no clue what to do or how to handle it.
Watching the Democrats in this presidential race was very familiar to
me.
I had already seen this show in Massachusetts. Clinton vs Trump was
basically Coakley vs Brown all over again. The Democrats were all puffed
up and arrogant thinking that there was no way they could lose in both
races. After all there was no way Bluest of Blue voters in Massachusetts
would vote to replace the "Liberal Lion" Ted Kennedy with anybody but
another Democrat right? And the Clinton campaign and the DNC basically
were popping the corks on the champagne and preparing the fireworks
displays when Trump won the nomination. Because really, who would vote
for a nutty reality TV star and basically lousy businessman whose catch
phrase was "You're fired!" and liked to brag about how he could grope
women and walk into their dressing room to gawk at them changing.
Well, in both cases the Democrats had their heads totally up their
collective asses. And both times I tried to tell people "Look we have a
big problem here." and in both cases for doing so I mostly just got a lot
of grief. I don't really feel like there is a place anymore for my voice in
this
political landscape. I feel like the only voices that matter or are heard
now are the ones screaming how much they hate the other side. The anger
now is so great that no matter what one says it is taken as betrayal or
as a reason to fight. Sorry for the personal aside I guess this entire
process just really got to me this time and I feel pretty hurt by it.
So, was I surprised by Trump winning? A bit, yes. Mainly because all
the
money and power players seemed entirely aligned behind Hillary and in
general...I believe in following the money more than polls to predict
this stuff...that would normally mean that Clinton should have won.
However, the one thing I said about this was if they actually count
the
votes...because I felt it was debatable that we would get an accurate
vote count...then Trump had a very good chance to win.
So, if you want to say something good about this election, and
honestly I
don't have much good to say about it, it would be that this actually
appears to have been the real deal. It was democracy in action. They
really counted the votes because if there was ever going to be a fix in
it would have been in this election because all of Wall Street and the
banks, Big Energy, all the money, and even most big name Republicans all
were backing Hillary.
She had it all and was running against a guy that was rated as one of
the
worst presidential candidates in our history that also was completely
self destructive. A guy that was so divisive that his very presence in
this election cycle was supposed to have a catastrophic effect on the
Republican party for years. Even on election day people in his own
campaign were saying it would take a miracle for him to win.
Well, I guess we should all believe in miracles now. In polling it
showed
60% of the country could not stand the guy...and they voted for him
anyway.
They said the Latino vote would crush Trump. Well, more Latinos voted
for
Donald Trump than voted for Mitt Romney. Trump "broke the blue wall"
meaning in states like Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, and Michigan he won
because Democrats voted for him as well just like in that long ago
Massachusetts senate race Democrats voted for Scott Brown.
I understand how it happened and Michael Moore was not the first or
only
person to predict it could happen. There were plenty of people saying
"Danger Will Robinson!"
You could see Clinton had serious potential to struggle and a lot
played
into that. I also think that Americans hate the idea of someone being
"entitled" to the presidency and everybody (SNL skits, comedians, talk
shows) all played up the idea that Clinton felt the job belonged to
her...that she was heir to the throne...and along with the fact that they
did not like her, thought she was dishonest, did not trust her...they did
not want to hand her the job because they felt nobody is "heir" to the
presidency.
So, the vote was not just a rejection of Clinton it was a rejection
of
the idea that anybody is "entitled" to the job as well.
Combine this with the fact that Clinton ran a horrible campaign. Her
entire message appeared to be "Vote for me because I stink less than the
other guy." and that's not a message that will win you an election. You
also know you have a major problem when people in your own campaign say
that if they could just hide her somewhere until November 8th Hillary
could win easily.
And then there is of course what Moore says in his video. Trump was
the
chance for all of these forgotten, dumped on, made fun of people to throw
a hand grenade into the system...and they took it. Yes, those of us that
live on the East and West coasts and fly over them on the way back and
forth between the two maybe did not grasp how horribly wrong so many of
these people's lives have gone.
To me it is sort of sad that we can have this outpouring of
compassion
when we read a story of people's water being poisoned in a run down
suburb but the same people that are so filled with compassion when that
happens explode with hatred, anger, and name calling when these poor
people vote for Trump because they feel it is their only option to say
"Fuck you!" to a government that appears to not give a shit about them.
Clinton was exactly the kind of establishment politician that so many
voters rejected during the primary process. Our system has been failing
these people horribly for about the last 40 years. Should we really be
surprised that the people the system continues to fail voted against that
system?
Are we really surprised that these people that have lost their jobs,
their retirement money, their homes, would turn on the Clintons? While
Bill and Hillary spent the time since Bill left the White House raking in
3 billion dollars from all over the planet and selling off bits and
pieces of our government in the process?
I don't think Trump is the answer by any stretch and I certainly
think he
looks at that 3 billion and thinks "If they got 3 billion I can get 3
times that amount!"
This is the tragedy. I understand why these people voted for Trump
but I
find it highly unlikely he will help them nor keep any of his campaign
promises. He certainly is not going to send Hillary or Bill to jail for
doing something he would foam at the mouth to do himself.
You want to know how I think Trump sees all the stuff he said and
promised during his nutty campaign?
It was just business. He saw that was a path to "winning" and he took
it.
I think this whole thing will go the same way Scott Brown's senate
run
went. People threw the grenade to send the message...and in 4 years they
will vote this guy out when he reveals he was not going to do what he
said he was going to do...if he does not come unhinged and do something
that causes him to get impeached before his 4 years are up.
–--
'The only way to avoid getting crushed by absurdity, is to humbly include the absurd in our calculations.'
'The only way to avoid getting crushed by absurdity, is to humbly include the absurd in our calculations.'
Reg
(view)
Yes, my thinking was Hillary would win because basically most signs
pointed to that and Trump was a very very self destructive candidate. I
thought it would be close though and that Hillary would win by a slim
margin. It seemed a lot of people felt she would have a giant victory and
that's what most in the media predicted but there was all along one giant
indicator that she would struggle.
The country during the primaries voted in a very big way against
establishment candidates. Trump destroyed the establishment Republicans
in the primary. The Republican party had a gigantic WTF moment watching
this happen and obviously had no clue what to do or how to handle it.
Watching the Democrats in this presidential race was very familiar to
me.
I had already seen this show in Massachusetts. Clinton vs Trump was
basically Coakley vs Brown all over again. The Democrats were all puffed
up and arrogant thinking that there was no way they could lose in both
races. After all there was no way Bluest of Blue voters in Massachusetts
would vote to replace the "Liberal Lion" Ted Kennedy with anybody but
another Democrat right? And the Clinton campaign and the DNC basically
were popping the corks on the champagne and preparing the fireworks
displays when Trump won the nomination. Because really, who would vote
for a nutty reality TV star and basically lousy businessman whose catch
phrase was "You're fired!" and liked to brag about how he could grope
women and walk into their dressing room to gawk at them changing.
Well, in both cases the Democrats had their heads totally up their
collective asses. And both times I tried to tell people "Look we have a
big problem here." and in both cases for doing so I mostly just got a lot
of grief. I don't really feel like there is a place anymore for my voice in
this
political landscape. I feel like the only voices that matter or are heard
now are the ones screaming how much they hate the other side. The anger
now is so great that no matter what one says it is taken as betrayal or
as a reason to fight. Sorry for the personal aside I guess this entire
process just really got to me this time and I feel pretty hurt by it.
So, was I surprised by Trump winning? A bit, yes. Mainly because all
the
money and power players seemed entirely aligned behind Hillary and in
general...I believe in following the money more than polls to predict
this stuff...that would normally mean that Clinton should have won.
However, the one thing I said about this was if they actually count
the
votes...because I felt it was debatable that we would get an accurate
vote count...then Trump had a very good chance to win.
So, if you want to say something good about this election, and
honestly I
don't have much good to say about it, it would be that this actually
appears to have been the real deal. It was democracy in action. They
really counted the votes because if there was ever going to be a fix in
it would have been in this election because all of Wall Street and the
banks, Big Energy, all the money, and even most big name Republicans all
were backing Hillary.
She had it all and was running against a guy that was rated as one of
the
worst presidential candidates in our history that also was completely
self destructive. A guy that was so divisive that his very presence in
this election cycle was supposed to have a catastrophic effect on the
Republican party for years. Even on election day people in his own
campaign were saying it would take a miracle for him to win.
Well, I guess we should all believe in miracles now. In polling it
showed
60% of the country could not stand the guy...and they voted for him
anyway.
They said the Latino vote would crush Trump. Well, more Latinos voted
for
Donald Trump than voted for Mitt Romney. Trump "broke the blue wall"
meaning in states like Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, and Michigan he won
because Democrats voted for him as well just like in that long ago
Massachusetts senate race Democrats voted for Scott Brown.
I understand how it happened and Michael Moore was not the first or
only
person to predict it could happen. There were plenty of people saying
"Danger Will Robinson!"
You could see Clinton had serious potential to struggle and a lot
played
into that. I also think that Americans hate the idea of someone being
"entitled" to the presidency and everybody (SNL skits, comedians, talk
shows) all played up the idea that Clinton felt the job belonged to
her...that she was heir to the throne...and along with the fact that they
did not like her, thought she was dishonest, did not trust her...they did
not want to hand her the job because they felt nobody is "heir" to the
presidency.
So, the vote was not just a rejection of Clinton it was a rejection
of
the idea that anybody is "entitled" to the job as well.
Combine this with the fact that Clinton ran a horrible campaign. Her
entire message appeared to be "Vote for me because I stink less than the
other guy." and that's not a message that will win you an election. You
also know you have a major problem when people in your own campaign say
that if they could just hide her somewhere until November 8th Hillary
could win easily.
And then there is of course what Moore says in his video. Trump was
the
chance for all of these forgotten, dumped on, made fun of people to throw
a hand grenade into the system...and they took it. Yes, those of us that
live on the East and West coasts and fly over them on the way back and
forth between the two maybe did not grasp how horribly wrong so many of
these people's lives have gone.
To me it is sort of sad that we can have this outpouring of
compassion
when we read a story of people's water being poisoned in a run down
suburb but the same people that are so filled with compassion when that
happens explode with hatred, anger, and name calling when these poor
people vote for Trump because they feel it is their only option to say
"Fuck you!" to a government that appears to not give a shit about them.
Clinton was exactly the kind of establishment politician that so many
voters rejected during the primary process. Our system has been failing
these people horribly for about the last 40 years. Should we really be
surprised that the people the system continues to fail voted against that
system?
Are we really surprised that these people that have lost their jobs,
their retirement money, their homes, would turn on the Clintons? While
Bill and Hillary spent the time since Bill left the White House raking in
3 billion dollars from all over the planet and selling off bits and
pieces of our government in the process?
I don't think Trump is the answer by any stretch and I certainly
think he
looks at that 3 billion and thinks "If they got 3 billion I can get 3
times that amount!"
This is the tragedy. I understand why these people voted for Trump
but I
find it highly unlikely he will help them nor keep any of his campaign
promises. He certainly is not going to send Hillary or Bill to jail for
doing something he would foam at the mouth to do himself.
You want to know how I think Trump sees all the stuff he said and
promised during his nutty campaign?
It was just business. He saw that was a path to "winning" and he took
it.
I think this whole thing will go the same way Scott Brown's senate
run
went. People threw the grenade to send the message...and in 4 years they
will vote this guy out when he reveals he was not going to do what he
said he was going to do...if he does not come unhinged and do something
that causes him to get impeached before his 4 years are up.
–--
'The only way to avoid getting crushed by absurdity, is to humbly include the absurd in our calculations.'
'The only way to avoid getting crushed by absurdity, is to humbly include the absurd in our calculations.'
