Green, you kept your dignity well during my rant, however you cannot use Jesus running amok around the temple with the stall holders as a reason for all out war and blood letting every time it seems that one's personal safety is on the line. Pat has valid points to make too, but pacifism isn't about lying down in the face of tyranny - it's about using compassion and love as tools to overcome hatred and divisiveness, and both of you can do this, it's your Buddha nature (the difference between us again you believe in original sin, we believe in original purity). You know I believe that if the Germans had had a sense of humour circa 1920 onwards Hitler would have gotten nowhere. As soon as he would have gotten up to speak people would have broken out in gales of laughter - ) it happened in a parallel universe where Kevin's cyclists ran down that pregnant woman! Kathryn is having an affair there - Brad is a woman there