The simple answer was they came here due to a love of the songs you wrote. Once the conversation here expanded out past that, well, other aspects of these people emerged. I do think at a certain point, some of the reason they were saying what they were saying was simply to be antagonistic, particularly to you as your name is on the door here. 

I did my damnedest to figure out where Pat and Marc were coming from on things, to try to understand what exactly their points were. The general gist seemed to be they possessed little understanding of history, or what was actually happening, were unaware of the facts, and had been propagandized to a fare-thee-well by a right-wing media that continued to grow and expand during the time this board has existed. Basically, making the problem worse. 

The history of this board does in some ways really show a history of how this country got to the election of 2016...which now is quite obviously a turning point for this country and American politics. That's why when you brought up the board history before I said you mean as foreshadowing...because I really think it works as that.

The thing that is clear to me reading that stuff is the rise of a Trump style figure was coming. I recall thinking, and writing here probably a bunch of times, that it would not be possible for the Republicans to top how horrid George W. Bush was and the mess he led us into as a country. I just did not think it could get worse than that at the time. He began what was meant to be a never-ending war. A war that was not confined to countries and uniforms, but where the enemy could be anywhere, at any time, all at once. A war that did not really come to an end until Biden took office. The Bush administration created a situation where the presidents that followed would be forced to funnel larger and larger sums of cash into the military industrial complex and defense spending. That forced following administrations into the most giant game of whack-a-mole mankind has ever seen. 

I did not see Trump coming at the time though and he really unleashed hell on this country. His area of expertise not being external war but rather internal war. Where his goal was to set Americans on other Americans and wow, did he accomplish that. He split families and friends, pushed a tidal wave of hate, anger, and confusion that has swamped this country since his arrival. 

All of this grew while this board and our talking history existed. I don't know what information Pat and Marc base their thoughts on but I do know that there is a lot of really bad propaganda available to them and Trump expanded and amplified that in astounding ways. 

To the extent that, as here we sit, his lawyers are making the argument in court that Trump should be allowed to lie to his followers and that right should not be impeded. This fantastic example being set by a former US president. His followers, whomever they are, don't make a peep about it. Nothing. 

I think there were not many of these types around here and in reality, Pat and Marc were not anywhere near the worst of that group of people. There are some really vile ones out there. Like the guy that is already tapped to be part of the next Trump administration that said just the other day, and this is a quote, "We are going to put kids in cages and it will be glorious!" 

Vile fucking filth. 

To me, your songs, the thing that drew people here, were suffused with a humanist outlook. Which, sure, I don't know what they meant to others but in some ways I thought of them with the idea that if someone liked them, they too shared that outlook. 

I never got the feeling that any of these guys like Pat or Marc hated us or wished us harm. Yeah, Marc did tell me to go fuck myself once but he said that was meant as comedy. They may be rude or offensive, but I am most curious now how they see Trump going full Hitler. 

I think Pat has said he is no longer a Trump supporter. I think he is without a candidate right now because his choice was DeSantis but I think he now acknowledges Ron has tanked. So, he is kind of waiting to see who the Republican is and if it is Trump...I don't know if he would vote for him again. Marc is a mystery to me as well, in that I never got to have a really good back and forth with him. He was all in with Trump in 2016 and because he wanted to "throw the grenade" that blew up our government. Now I wonder if he still thinks that was a good call. 

These guys never really did a good job of explaining their beliefs, things would get more and more murky and confusing the further you would get into a conversation. I mean they could claim Lincoln was one of them as a Republican, not at all grasping that the Republican party of Lincoln was a progressive party. Something they now would never identify with just as Lincoln would wonder now what the hell happened to his Republican party. 

The mind boggles at Lincoln having a sit down with the likes of Marge Greene, Matt Gaetz, Jim Jordan or...good god, Donald Trump.